Bryan McAnulty [00:00:00]:

In a world that feels dominated by algorithms and AI, how can creators stay true to who they are and inspire.

Speaker B [00:00:05]:

Others through their character?

Bryan McAnulty [00:00:06]:

Today we have the pleasure to interview Dane Dutch, a former US Air Force commander, CEO of five companies, university instructor, and the author of the Tricycle Effect. Dane has taken decades of leadership experience and turned it into a powerful framework.

Speaker B [00:00:20]:

That helps creators and entrepreneurs lead with.

Bryan McAnulty [00:00:22]:

Character, build trust, and create meaningful success.

Dane Deutsch [00:00:25]:

But.

Bryan McAnulty [00:00:25]:

But Dain's journey didn't stop with leadership. He's climbed Mount Ararat, taught thousands of students about cyber ethics, and even ran for state senate. Always driven by a commitment to integrity and resilience, Dane is here to share how creators can apply the Tricycle Effect to grow their audience, stay aligned with their values, and build businesses that truly matter. If you're ready to lead with character and turn your passion into purpose, this.

Speaker B [00:00:48]:

Episode is for you.

Dane Deutsch [00:00:49]:

First of all, good leaders know that people are not a resource. A resource is something to be used and used up.

Speaker D [00:00:55]:

But.

Dane Deutsch [00:00:55]:

But people are our greatest assets. That means we have to develop them, we have to grow them, we have to make sure we're taking care of them.

Bryan McAnulty [00:01:02]:

Welcome to the Creator's Adventure, where we interview creators from around the world, hearing their stories about growing a business. Hey, everyone. I'm Brian McAnulty, the founder of Heights platform.

Speaker B [00:01:12]:

Let's get into it. Hey, Dane. Welcome to the show.

Speaker D [00:01:21]:

Hey.

Dane Deutsch [00:01:21]:

Thank you, Brian. Glad to be here and real privilege to be able to spend some time with you.

Speaker B [00:01:27]:

Yeah, I'm always excited to be able to talk to my own customers here on this show and be able to really meet you here for the first time. So my first question for you is something I like to ask everyone. That's what is the biggest thing you did or you are doing that has helped you to achieve the freedom to do what you enjoy?

Dane Deutsch [00:01:46]:

I think, number one, I just believed that I didn't have to follow the crowd.

Speaker D [00:01:51]:

Right?

Dane Deutsch [00:01:52]:

I could be. And I have five different companies, so I've been an entrepreneur from scratch, so to speak, but really wanted to be able to launch out on my own. And I just want to encourage those people that are out there in our audience today that are listening, if they have that same desire, that same heartfelt, like, burning desire to be able to follow that path, take it. Just take it. You're never going to really know what's going to happen until you actually take the first step. And taking the first step is the hardest step, right? Takes a lot of courage. In our gym, I'm a professional gymnastics coach and one of the things we talk about is character, competence, and grit. And grit is a big part of entrepreneurship, and it's probably not as often talked about, but just being able to make that first courageous decision is your biggest decision.

Dane Deutsch [00:02:43]:

And then after that, it's to have the grit to continue.

Speaker B [00:02:47]:

Yeah. So, yeah, you had multiple career paths from being a commander in the military, running for state senate, and now a creator, author, keynote speaker. Looking back, what other advice would you give yourself when you started out as a creator? And. And maybe with what you just said, like, when did you realize for yourself that, like, okay, I want. I want to do this.

Dane Deutsch [00:03:12]:

Yeah. So I think when we came back from the military, my dad was dying. He had been given six months to live. And my background, by the way, in my last two years in college was in kinesiotherapy. So when I got home, I started doing some kinesiotherapy with him, and he actually improved. And he lived another 30 years, more than 30 years. And so he was able to build my extended family by coming home with my dad. But I think just following in my mom and dad's footsteps as entrepreneurs.

Dane Deutsch [00:03:47]:

In my first book, I talk about my dad actually telling my mom, here's $1,000, you can start your elf shelf. That was the crafts and art store that she wanted to start as an entrepreneur. This is back in the 70s, early 70s, women were not really, you know, looked upon in a good way in starting their own businesses. But my mom wanted to do it, and my dad was pretty sure within.

Speaker E [00:04:13]:

A couple months should be done, and it'll be out of her system and then we can just move on.

Speaker D [00:04:16]:

Right.

Dane Deutsch [00:04:17]:

Never happened. It got more successful. Got more successful mostly because my mom just really put her heart into it, and she made connections and relationships with her customers and not just sold them something with this dry, kind of, I don't really care if I get to know you attitude, which is what a lot of the her competitors are doing.

Speaker D [00:04:37]:

Right.

Dane Deutsch [00:04:38]:

People would come in and they talk about their families or whatever, and it takes time. And she took that time, and. And I really admired that. So that's when we got home from the military after having my last job in the country of Turkey. I was the chief of maintenance for all of the it from the Mediterranean to the Black Sea and from Iraq to Istanbul. And it was the largest chief maintenance job in the world. A lot of responsibility. I loved it, but I knew I had to go home and support my family with my dad dying.

Dane Deutsch [00:05:07]:

And when I got home, my mom and dad we settled down in their hometown. And it was just natural to follow in my mom's footsteps. And I have another book, player's book, Entrepreneur Playbook, that I was a co author in for that anthology that actually brought that out was that I was following in my mom's footsteps and then of course my mom and dad's footsteps later.

Speaker B [00:05:32]:

And you have the book the Tricycle Effect. That's your most recent book, right?

Dane Deutsch [00:05:37]:

Yeah. So my most recent book, that was my very first book in the Tricycle Effect series of books. My second book was Coachability, which I released in November of last year. And that book, I titled it Coach Dashability because it was the ability to be coached either by yourself, by others, or you coaching others. So there's three parts to that book and I start out with coaching yourself as the most important. But that's my second in a series of what I call the Tricycle Effect. And, and I've got other books that I'm already working on. AI and the Tricycle Effect will be an upcoming book.

Dane Deutsch [00:06:18]:

Yeah, because we've got to keep that humanity as, you know, the ability to be able to humanize AI instead of just accept whatever artificial intelligence is giving us and then spewing it back out or providing it back out there without our own touch, without our own creativity, without our own soul in it, in reality.

Speaker D [00:06:40]:

Right.

Dane Deutsch [00:06:41]:

So that, that's my next book.

Speaker B [00:06:43]:

Cool. Yeah. I definitely want to talk more about AI, but I guess first on the Tricycle Effect. So can you explain more of like what is the Tricycle Effect and like what, what made you decide that you have to share that with the world?

Dane Deutsch [00:06:56]:

Yeah, absolutely. So if I can. Let me give you just a quick little story. When I first got home, we didn't have any money. We lived in Turkey for five years, my family and I, four kids, wife and I. And we lost touch with the United States entirely because we're on the other side of the globe, so to speak. And so when we got home, I had to have a job. So I as a teacher by degree and a coach by profession, I went out and started substitute teaching.

Dane Deutsch [00:07:20]:

So the first job I got was in a little bitty town where they had an elementary school and the middle school and high school were combined. So I was the, I was going there as a long term sub for a physical education teacher. And so I started my class in the morning and first teacher brought her students into the gym. We lined them up and then she said, have you had Mikey yet? And I was like, nope, I don't Know a Mikey yet? This is my first day. I've never been here before. And so she kind of chuckled, finished my first class. Second teacher brought her class in, lined them up, and then she said, hey, have you met Mikey yet?

Speaker E [00:07:59]:

I was like, no, I haven't met Mike yet. That's interesting. Two teachers have brought that up without me actually, you know, starting the conversation.

Dane Deutsch [00:08:08]:

And then when the third teacher came in and after she lined up all the students with me, she said, have you seen Mikey? And I said, oh, Mikey must be interesting person, you know, because this is the third teacher. Well, as it turns out, at noon I went over to have my lunch in the middle school. And I finished lunch. I walked into the gym. It was like a scene out of an Animal House movie. I mean, one kid had his butt in the hoop, in the basketball hoop. There were kids climbing up the bleachers. I blew my whistle.

Dane Deutsch [00:08:39]:

Not even a. Not even a little hint that they were listening at all. They just didn't respond. And I tried blowing my whistle again. Then there was a guy, one student that was standing right next to me, very quiet, as opposed to everybody else. And I said, hey, do you know who Mikey is? And immediately the whole gym went quiet and everybody stopped. And then like in a movie, all these kids that were in the middle of the gym started to separate away. And this kid from the other side of the gym started walking towards me, right down that middle, got right up in my face.

Dane Deutsch [00:09:14]:

He said, hi, Mikey, what do you want? I was like, oh, my goodness.

Speaker D [00:09:21]:

This.

Speaker E [00:09:21]:

Is going to be interesting.

Dane Deutsch [00:09:23]:

I said, hey, Mikey, I need somebody to help me lead classes. And you can stand right up here and help me lead. And he said, oh, no, I could never be a leader. I'm not a leader. I said, of course you are, and I'll help you. We'll do it together, okay? So he reluctantly got on the. On the spot on the floor, which he had marked out with tape ahead of time. He led classes with me for the next two weeks in that long term sub job that I had.

Dane Deutsch [00:09:47]:

And then I thought it was going to be longer than two weeks and the teacher was coming back early. And so that second week, at the end of the week on Friday, I was in the locker room, and, you know, locker rooms echo generally. I was filling out the last part of the grade book, had my head down in the grade book, and all of a sudden I heard the door close to my office. I looked up and I could tell it was Mikey, but he had his back to me and he Was finishing closing the door, and he turned around and he had these huge tears coming down his cheeks. And I said, what's wrong, Mikey? He said, oh, Coach, Mr. D, you're the only one who has ever cared about me. And, you know, from the time I put him on that leader mark on the gym the very first day to the last day, he never once acted up for me. The other kids respected him naturally, right? So he was a leader in reality, but he was just leading them all in the wrong direction.

Dane Deutsch [00:10:47]:

So that told me and taught me a lot about the fact that people out here have a lot of potential. Sometimes they don't feel like there are other people around them to help them with that potential. But I write about that story in my first book and my second book, I reiterate, go back and review it again, because it really emphasizes the fact that we need to lead with character first. Don't put people in a box and label it and then treat them that way. You know, find out who they are, what are their needs, what are their real desires, their aspirations, what is their passions, what are their purposes. And I don't know where Mikey is today, but I hope that he had an opportunity to see that he truly was a leader. He just needed to be able to channel that leadership in a productive way that was improving the lives of other people around and making a difference, right? Adding value to other people. So that tricycle effect that I have, if you think about a tricycle, we all have ridden tricycles, right? Or big wheels anyway, depending on the.

Speaker E [00:11:45]:

Decade that you grew up for when you were little.

Dane Deutsch [00:11:48]:

And I like to say that we as adults are just big kids, really, we are. Our personality doesn't change when we're thinking three to five, seven years old. That personality that we had is still the same personality we have today. Oh, we can put a better face on, or we can hide it better, or we can cover it up better, or we can fake it, but really the personality is still the same. But our character, our character is coachable. And the character skills, like respect or empathy or loyalty or trustworthiness or respect. I mean, think about it. If you want more respect, you gotta practice respect.

Dane Deutsch [00:12:23]:

If you want to be more caring, you got to practice care. And we can do that with those character skills. So being that it's kids, I wanted an image that people could remember. So let me paint this image of the tricycle effect, and then people will remember that forever. That front wheel is the character skills wheel. So all the spokes on that wheel are Things like trustworthiness, respect, responsibility, fairness, caring, empathy, loyalty, integrity and so forth. The back two wheels are what I call the competence wheels. So they're much smaller, but they should be balanced in size.

Dane Deutsch [00:12:56]:

One is the technical skill wheel, like can you run a podcast, can you type on a keyboard, can you bake a cake, can you fix a car, can you fly a plane? Those are technical skills. The other wheel is the people skill wheel, what a lot of people refer to as soft skills. That people skill wheel would be things like teamwork, communication, the ability to be able to critically think those kinds of things, problem solve. Teamwork is a big part of that. But communication is a big part of that as well. Well, most of the time those wheels should be balanced. Most of the time these days people are driving around on, riding around on a big technical wheel, smaller people skill wheel, and an almost non existent character wheel. And so my goal with the tricycle effect is to bring that back into view so that they realize I need to expand that character wheel, I need to reduce my technical wheel focus more on people skills, which is where we really get the value out of life the most.

Dane Deutsch [00:13:57]:

Life is just as rich as the relationships that we have with other people. And then of course, the seat and the tricycle effect is the seat of courage. You and I talked a little bit about courage before we came on and you know, the courage to do the right thing at the right time for the right reason. And if you think about on a tricycle, the handlebars are connected to the front wheel, the pedals are connected to the front wheel. So you get your direction and your momentum in life from your character skill wheel. We just haven't actually broken it down like that. And almost any major player out there in the leadership arena, if they start to talk to you about leadership or other skills, communication, teamwork and so forth, they're always going to be talking about character skills, but they don't bring that out forward up front for people to really gain that understanding.

Speaker D [00:14:50]:

Right.

Dane Deutsch [00:14:50]:

And I really love the idea that John Maxwell, in his book Developing Leader within youn, the very first version, chapter three said was titled Integrity and the subtitle was An Essential Ingredient in Leadership. Just an essential ingredient in leadership.

Speaker D [00:15:09]:

Right.

Dane Deutsch [00:15:10]:

And I read that book. I was actually, that was the first book I was actually licensed to be able to teach for him. And within the last two or three years he wrote a second book. So it's Developing Leader within youn 2.0. He changed the third chapter's title from Integrity to Character and he changed the subtitle from integrity as an essential ingredient of Leadership to Character as the foundation of leadership. And so that's why you always see these leadership trainers and teachers and coaches just like me talking about leadership. And we'll refer to character skills. But we just don't go back and say, hey, the character needs to be the foundation of leadership first.

Dane Deutsch [00:15:56]:

We need to lead with character first.

Speaker D [00:15:58]:

Right.

Dane Deutsch [00:15:59]:

And so that's the whole intention of the tricycle effect. And my first book is filled with heartfelt stories like Chicken Soup for the Soul, kind of stories from my family, my military career, my teaching career, my gymnastics gym that we currently still coach at. And then this is our 35th year now. My wife is a director there. I work for her. I just do the flippy things and I do the strong, like the strength thing. She's all the brains, I'm just the brawn. I flip the kids.

Dane Deutsch [00:16:29]:

But she does all the smart things. So it's really my emphasis, my purpose and passion in this third triad or triad of my life is to be able to help people go back and reconnect with those character skills. How can we reconnect the heart? So one on one, we're making a difference for other people and adding value. And in this crazy world today, it's more needed than ever. Even a lot of churches are not fulfilling that need. And we need to get back to building relationships and making sure that that is the one thing that counts the most.

Speaker B [00:17:03]:

Yeah, yeah. I mean, I agree. And when I was looking up and trying to learn a little bit more about you before this, I noticed that emphasis on character, and I think you articulated it so well there. But one thing you brought to my mind, maybe a little bit corny, but I pulled it up. Here is a quote from a movie, Fast and Furious, Tokyo Drift, actually, where the main character in the story, he travels to Tokyo and this guy lets him borrow his car to go and race it, and he completely wrecks it. First time he tries to race it. And so he says, why do you let me race your car? You knew I was going to wreck it. And the owner says, why not? And he says, well, because it costs a lot of money.

Speaker B [00:17:49]:

And he says, I have money. It's trust and character I need around me. You know, who you choose to be around you lets you know who you are. And one car in exchange for knowing what a man's worth, that's a price I can live with. And maybe corny, especially expecting that it's from that movie, but I thought it was an interesting quote and that resonated with me as well. The importance of character.

Dane Deutsch [00:18:11]:

Yeah, absolutely. That's a great quote. It's, you know, I think to people who really don't understand and don't take the character skill growth seriously, they might think it's corny. But for those of us that really can talk to each other and connect heart to heart, I think that that really resonates and hits home.

Speaker D [00:18:29]:

All right.

Dane Deutsch [00:18:30]:

It really hits you in the heart because you know very well that the trust, the five people that you have around you, the closest to you, are who you're going to become. And so that relationship thing is really important. If it's all about the technical skills or money and, you know, just physical, tangible kind of assets in your life, then you're going to have this hollow life that is constantly hungry and missing something, but you don't know what it is. And really, God created us so that we could actually be communing and building relationships with other humans and. And that's the thing that we hunger for the most. So, great, great share. Thanks a lot, Brian. Yeah, that was.

Dane Deutsch [00:19:10]:

That was a great quote.

Speaker B [00:19:11]:

Yeah, yeah. So, well, how can, like, a creator go and apply kind of that concept of the tricycle effect?

Dane Deutsch [00:19:19]:

So I think, especially in my second book, I talk about coaching yourself first, right? You can't coach others unless you actually can coach yourself and lead yourself first. A lot of times people, when they take a leadership class, we talk about leading others. Right, but not necessarily leading yourself. I'll give you a great example that when I ran for state senate, and this is in one of my books as well, at one of the debates one night, my opponent and I were debating and, you know, you the first person to ask the first question, then they alternate. You get to be the first person next time and then the other opponent the third time and so forth. On this particular instance, my opponent got the question first. So they said, what is the greatest resource in northwest Wisconsin? Because I'm in northwest Wisconsin right now, right?

Speaker E [00:20:07]:

Which is six below right now. And we've got snow on the ground finally.

Dane Deutsch [00:20:11]:

And the response that the opponent gave was immediately was, our people, our people are our greatest resource. Now, on the surface, that sounds great, but for those of us that have taught leadership, there's something much more important there. And so immediately I was like, smiling.

Speaker E [00:20:33]:

Ear to ear, and people were probably wondering, why is he smiling when she's talking like that? I was like, I know exactly how to respond to this.

Dane Deutsch [00:20:40]:

And so when they came to me and Said, okay, so you have your two minutes. Dane, you know what, what would you like to say and how are you going to counter that? I said, well, first of all, good leaders know that people are not a resource. A resource is something to be used and used up like minerals, trees, water. People are our greatest asset. That means we have to develop them, we have to grow them, we have to make sure we're taking care of them. And that's what I'm going to do for you as a state senator. So it was just a nice segue right into that.

Speaker D [00:21:12]:

Right.

Dane Deutsch [00:21:13]:

But too often we get people that are focused on accolades. You know, they've got these, you know, lots of frames in their office and they're bragging about who they are and so forth. Oh, my goodness, I've had so many failures in my life and every one of them is a stepping stone to the next step of success. You know, when we climbed up Mount Arat and I did that 17,000 foot mountain in eastern Turkey, one of the few Americans or people in the world to actually climb to the peak. It was an extinct volcano. And so if you took a step, you sometimes slid back three or four feet. You had to be really careful. It was a very dangerous mountain.

Dane Deutsch [00:21:49]:

Actually, in Turkish it's called Arida. Ari in Turkish means pain and da means mountain. So it literally means mountain of pain.

Speaker D [00:21:58]:

Right.

Dane Deutsch [00:21:59]:

But it really emphasizes the idea that, hey, I can take a step forward, but I might slide back a little bit before I can actually gain any more traction to get ahead in life. And too often we don't want any of that pain, we don't want any of that challenge, we don't want any of those struggles.

Speaker D [00:22:14]:

Right.

Dane Deutsch [00:22:16]:

And, and really that's a part of life. But if we have people like we did on the climb up Monterey Rat that you can support and that support you, oh my goodness, you can make it to the peak and beyond. And so it really emphasizes the idea that we've got to go back, reconnect with people's hearts, especially with all the changes and the chaos and the things that are going on in the world right now. People are hungry to find other people that have a message, a message of hope. And I think the trace of hope effect is that message of hope.

Speaker B [00:22:47]:

Yeah, yeah, that's great. And that reminds me of a time earlier in my business where I had the wrong idea about things and I was, I guess, afraid to take the step forward where I might end up going back a little bit. And I kind of had this approach that I Was I guess for a year I kind of tried the four hour work week lifestyle to see like, is this for me? Like does is my business gonna keep going? How's this all gonna work? And long story short is I realized it's, it's not the way I want to do things. It wasn't really fulfilling. But the part of the reason I was afraid of doing things was I was wanted to build other things, but I wanted to like maintain the hourly rate that I had of like calculating, okay, well if I work an hour, I probably make this much. It wasn't directly an hourly rate cause it wasn't really service based at that point. But I didn't want to go and do a bunch of things where I wouldn't make that hourly rate or I'd be lowering my effective hourly rate. And what that meant is I was afraid to invest in myself.

Speaker B [00:24:00]:

And I, I was only able to grow and really get to the next level with things. Once I realized, you know what, like, it's not about that at all. Just completely forget about that. I have to be willing to invest in myself into something bigger and that's the way it would have to work. And once I learned to embrace that, then so many things changed.

Dane Deutsch [00:24:25]:

That's a great story. And you know, it really points back to being, going back and just being authentic with yourself and genuine.

Speaker D [00:24:33]:

Right.

Dane Deutsch [00:24:33]:

And then the pressure of all the business, a lot of that pressure dissipates. I found that over the years, if I try to put on a face or I try to do something that's not really me, it doesn't fit very well.

Speaker E [00:24:43]:

It's like putting on clothes that don't fit you.

Speaker D [00:24:45]:

Right.

Dane Deutsch [00:24:46]:

You got to find that good fit. And, and that's one of the reasons why I came to Heights platform. Because you know, number one, I liked your philosophy. I could tell you're authentic and genuine. And that connection with authenticity is what attracts people. Even though other people may not realize that, but it's also what empowers you. And I think too often people think that, hey, you're vulnerable if you're genuine and authentic. If you tell someone your weakness or your struggle, you're vulnerable, then you're probably not successful.

Dane Deutsch [00:25:17]:

But there's a difference between success and significance. You know, in the tricycle effect, that character wheel in the front, I call that the significance wheel. And the two competence wheels on the back, those are the success wheels. You know, we can run all our life and get lots of money and have lots of accolades and a lot of resources. And big houses and cars and all that kind of thing. But when it comes down to the end of life, we're all going to the same place.

Speaker D [00:25:42]:

Right.

Dane Deutsch [00:25:43]:

What have you left as a message for humanity after you're gone? And I try to encourage people in my books to make sure that they're living their legacy, not just going to leave a legacy. And what you just said there about that, your journey with authenticity and genuineness empowering you, it's coming across in your videos and in how you're building your platform so other people have a voice to make a difference for the world, because they're making a difference for other people with the value that they're adding to that. So thank you.

Speaker B [00:26:14]:

Thank you. I'm glad to hear that. And. And I agree. Yeah. If you're authentic with things, you're. You're in a position of power because you have nothing to hide.

Dane Deutsch [00:26:24]:

Yeah.

Speaker D [00:26:24]:

You're.

Speaker B [00:26:24]:

You're just being yourself. You don't. You don't have to make up some story about something or. Or pretend about anything.

Speaker D [00:26:31]:

You're.

Speaker B [00:26:31]:

You're just being yourself. Yep.

Dane Deutsch [00:26:34]:

And I think we're happier because of that.

Speaker D [00:26:35]:

Right.

Dane Deutsch [00:26:36]:

And maybe happy isn't even really the best word, but we're joyful or content with being in that space that we. That we created.

Speaker D [00:26:45]:

Right.

Dane Deutsch [00:26:46]:

I oftentimes talk about Nick Foles, the Eagles quarterback, when he was the MVP during the Super Bowl. Won the Super Bowl. But he had sat on the bench for years behind Carson Wentz and others, and now was his time to shine.

Speaker D [00:26:59]:

Right.

Dane Deutsch [00:27:00]:

And when he got up in front of the press at the end of the game after they won the super bowl and he was the most valuable player, he didn't talk about all the great plays they made. That would be the technical piece.

Speaker D [00:27:10]:

Right.

Dane Deutsch [00:27:11]:

He didn't really necessarily talk, although he did give credit to Carson Wentz and to his team and all that kind of thing. But he didn't even really talk about himself in a way that would be bragging on himself. Instead, he talked about the fact that he had failed many times. He struggled. And he was encouraging people in this press conference that, hey, if you have struggles, embrace it. Because, you know, and this was the most important part of his speech. When you have struggles, you know, you're growing your character. So powerful.

Dane Deutsch [00:27:42]:

So he shared his struggles. And even if he's the we just won the super bowl and just won the mvp, he wasn't all about telling.

Speaker E [00:27:49]:

Him about the technical wheel. He was all about telling about his character wheel. And I just loved it.

Speaker B [00:27:54]:

Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's great. Yeah. I want to talk more about what you mentioned earlier with AI and I think this is something that I'm passionate about, AI and I think you have similar views to me on some of this where a lot of people have the maybe wrong idea about using it or they see other people who have the wrong idea about using it and they're, they're discouraged from it. They think, oh, I don't want AI. So, yeah, can you share some more of your view of like, in a world that's going to be continuously like more. Have more and more involvement of AI, how can creators build genuine connections and use it the right way?

Dane Deutsch [00:28:37]:

Sure. Let me preface that by saying that, that the next book, at least on my drawing table, my writing table, if you will, is going to be AI. Transhumanism and the tricycle effect. Part of what is happening right now. And I've been in the IT industry for over 42 years, having started my IT experience in the military with cyber security and that kind of thing, even back in the 80s. And we were 30 years ahead of where people were out here. My people put in the first email server in all of Europe ever, when it was called arpanet. Then my boss was President Reagan's communications director who handpicked me to run the country's it.

Dane Deutsch [00:29:15]:

And he and I at night would be shooting our Zenith 100 laptops across Motorola's first mobile phones. And we first started at 1200 baud.

Speaker E [00:29:26]:

Then we went to 2400 baht. And we thought we were screaming fast, right? Send, text each other, send a little email.

Dane Deutsch [00:29:32]:

In those days there was no WWW because there were no domains, there was no Internet, you know, the World Wide Web. So there was no domain to send anybody to. And you had an email address that.

Speaker E [00:29:43]:

Was like 12 to 15 letters long. And that's what it was. Just letters didn't identify who you're sending.

Dane Deutsch [00:29:48]:

It to at all. So that was very inhuman reality. But the interesting part was we had privacy, we had anonymity, something that is. And security was better, of course. But now that we've moved over to the Internet, whatever the military had back then, because we were all Wireless in the 80s in Turkey of all places, most modern equipment and most modern Internet, if you will, at the time we were still focused on people, but you could see that the fact that we were using email addresses that had no names and things like that, that the technology was taking a front row seat and not people, right? And I could even, right then actually Sense that this was going to change things in the future. Over the last seven years, I just retired as an instructor at a university teaching cyber technology ethics. But not ethics, philosophy ethics, but character ethics, real practical ethics. Because I am so concerned about the fact that we have moved from human to human interaction so that we can sit behind our screens now and say pretty much anything we want without seeing the effect of what we're saying or what we're doing on the other side of the screen.

Speaker D [00:31:09]:

Right.

Dane Deutsch [00:31:10]:

So cyberbullying is still on the rise. Pornography and a lot of other things are out there, all very destructive in building human relationships. So when people look at AI, you know, with all the different pieces that we've got out here now, it looks like you can be more effective and efficient. And you can. But if we just allow the AI, which is still artificial, right, that means basically it is not real, It's a tool, it's a resource, but it's not an asset. And I think too many times now we're going to have a difficult time because as they try to humanize AI, meaning I can create an avatar, looks and talks just like you and I right now. How do you know that I'm not the avatar for Dane? And he's sitting back there watching, right? You don't really know anymore because with Vasa out of Microsoft and what Google's done with DeepMind and other things, they are further ahead than what they're seeing right now is. And let me, let me let a secret out of the bag here.

Dane Deutsch [00:32:12]:

Whatever the we have now out here in the commercial sector, the military was done with and they gave it to the commercial sector. Just like arpanet, that was actually darpa, that started that. And so back in those days when DARPA was creating a lot of this technology, AI has been around since back in the 50s or even earlier in different forms or different ways that people thought about it. The AI is not a new concept. This is not like something that's all of a sudden come to the forefront. It's not, it's been here for a while and they've been working on it in the military and high end educational institutions for a long time. So with that said, if what we're seeing right now is out here in the commercial world, what have they got going already that's 20 to 30 years ahead of where we are now. And let me give you a true example of that.

Dane Deutsch [00:33:06]:

Most people think that Apple developed Siri. They didn't. It was darpa. When DARPA was done, DARPA Chief is on a video saying we gave it to Apple so that they could do what they wanted with it. So how much other of the technology has been deployed and actually built and created by the DOD or other entities? And then when they're done with it, or they've got it to a certain level that they're moving on, then they give it to the commercial sector. And that's what we did with arpanet. And that's why Internet existed.

Speaker D [00:33:39]:

Right?

Dane Deutsch [00:33:39]:

It was a collaborated, collaborative effort between the DoD and military and the government and our higher level educational institutions. So. So with that said, now I've got to go back and really focus on AI is just artificial. Don't allow them to move us more towards the cyber and inhuman part of technology, but make sure that we're adding the human element, we're humanizing the AI. So let's say that you go out and you use chat GPT to actually create an email series for your product that you're getting ready to launch, right? If you just take that email series and just put it out there, then there's no humanizing of it. But if you take that and you go back and you think, how can I make my audience realize that I care, that I empathize with them, that I feel what they're feeling. I'm just one of them. And you're putting that into what AI helped you create as kind of a foundation.

Dane Deutsch [00:34:39]:

But then you're adding that humanizing on top. You're going to be able to attract more customers and be much more successful and significant than you ever could have been by just regurgitating some AI output. Does that help?

Speaker B [00:34:54]:

Yeah, and I completely agree. And with AI, what we always tell creators, like we have a lot of leads that come to us and they start asking about heights platform because they hear that we're somehow involved with AI and they say, okay, well is it going to make the course for me? And we explained to them that no, it's not. And like we don't want to do that because the value in your course is from your unique message and experiences. And if you go to AI and say, hey, make me a course about leadership, it's going to be exactly the same as anybody else who goes to AI and says, make me a course about leadership. And yeah, you can put in some information about yourself, make it a little bit different, but it's not you, it's not really you. And I'm also kind of against some of the tools out there where it's like, okay, well you can upload everything that you've said. Now you've got this AI clone of yourself. Well, it's not really an AI clone of yourself.

Speaker B [00:35:51]:

Maybe eventually we'll get to a point where that works better. But, like, there's a lot of things that people could ask, and if they asked the AI clone that, and you never said anything about that, it could piece some things together and maybe respond something that looks convincing to be like what you would have said, but it's not you. It doesn't have your experiences. It doesn't have your unique message and knowledge. And so you want to be able to take that. You use AI as an instrument to be able to facilitate, a way to create and express yourself quicker, faster, better, but it still has to come from you.

Dane Deutsch [00:36:27]:

Yeah, absolutely. You know, I could even go as far as to say, hey, cyber and humanity, they. There are people in the world that are trying to merge those. That's what I call transhumanism. But in reality, if we say that, hey, AI is subservient to us as humans, that it should be our tool and our resource, but it's not an asset. We retain the ability to be able to call ourselves humans or assets, and we're just using the AI as a tool. And so that means we really got to go back and humanize it. And who is your audience taking into account who they really are as humans?

Speaker D [00:37:03]:

Right.

Dane Deutsch [00:37:03]:

What do they feel? What do they think? How do they, you know, consider this topic and then make sure whatever we're having AI spit out for us, that we're humanizing it and answering those questions that really affect the heart.

Speaker D [00:37:18]:

Right.

Speaker B [00:37:19]:

Yeah. So with everything said, what would you say is a maybe good takeaway or habit that entrepreneurs and creators can. Can adapt to strengthen their character?

Dane Deutsch [00:37:33]:

Yeah. So number one is focus on making sure that you're doing something to grow your character skills. Too often people kind of just roll through the day, right. They go to work, they've got technical things to get done, phone calls to answer. Things are on their plate, and they're not really thinking about what can I do for someone else? Taking the time to actually, least once a day, think, who around me can I add value to who has a need? And just by switching that mindset on to be able to think about other people, you'll find people coming to you more often and more of them probably because they realize that you're being kind, you're being respectful, your care.

Speaker D [00:38:20]:

Right.

Dane Deutsch [00:38:20]:

You empathize. Oh, my goodness. Right now, in our gym, we've Got lots of nurses and doctors. But I can tell you that a lot of the medical community people that we've got, they'll tell you that the environment they work in is toxic. That's the word they use. And so I said, well, okay, why is that? Because they felt like empathy wasn't there anymore. Empathy is a character skill. So I'll give you a great example of that.

Dane Deutsch [00:38:45]:

I was at a Milwaukee conference for veterans, and one of the people I got done speaking came up to my booth afterwards, and he said, that was great presentation. Thank you. And I was like, good. Did it help you in any way? He said, let me tell you a story. I started a new company because he's an entrepreneur. Started a new company, and I needed sales. So I hired some people, had degrees in sales and marketing, and my sales weren't going nowhere. In fact, they weren't going anywhere at all.

Dane Deutsch [00:39:14]:

And he said, I just couldn't figure it out. These people have degrees. They should be able to sell. And he said, then one day, I had this nurse who could not work in her toxic environment anymore come in and apply for a job in sales. And I said, well, you don't have any sales experience. She said, I know, I know. I'm a nurse, but I've worked with people, and if you just give me a chance. And so he did.

Dane Deutsch [00:39:38]:

And he said, in a very short period of time, sales were going through the roof. And he said, you know what it was, Dane? It was the fact that the nurse could empathize with the people at the other end of the phone. I Sometimes when I pick up the phone and talk to somebody, I'll tell them if it's true. Hey, I can hear you smiling. Because you can tell that somebody's smiling when they talk differently.

Speaker D [00:40:00]:

Right?

Dane Deutsch [00:40:01]:

There's a difference there. And he said, so now I don't.

Speaker E [00:40:04]:

Hire anybody but nurses from my sales staff. And he's saying, we're doing great.

Speaker B [00:40:09]:

So I can attest to the importance of that. Because my dad was involved, he was always in sales, and he would always tell me that empathy is the most.

Dane Deutsch [00:40:18]:

Important thing, but it's not a topic that a lot of people talk about, right?

Speaker B [00:40:23]:

Yeah.

Dane Deutsch [00:40:24]:

But when someone's hurting, they're hoping someone will empathize with them and care about them.

Speaker D [00:40:29]:

Right.

Dane Deutsch [00:40:29]:

And respect them for what they're going through, but we just don't have those conversations. So when I talk about changing that mindset, to be thinking about others, to be thinking about what character skills you're developing, try to do at Least one character skill effect or effort every day. Because by you focusing on empathy as an example, how can I empathize? What is that person really feeling asking those questions? People always say asking the question like Simon Sinek is probably the most important thing you can do. Ask the right question. But maybe we're not asking the right question all the time because we're thinking about things or resources, not other humans and how they're feeling. Especially with all this stuff going on with the fires and the hurricanes and, you know, all the things that have happened since COVID people seem to resonate with, hey, we've got to get back to something where we care for one another again as a humanity.

Speaker B [00:41:28]:

Yeah, that's great. All right. Well, on this show, I like to have every guest ask a question to the audience. So if you could ask our audience anything, whether something you're curious about or just want to get everybody thinking about, what would that be?

Dane Deutsch [00:41:40]:

Yeah. So I think it ties into what we just talked about a little bit there is just to find out, do you feel like the world's going in the right way, in the right direction, you know, with all the chaos that we've got? Do you feel like you're getting. Getting traction, like you have purpose, like your mission or your values that you want to be able to express? Do you feel like you're able to do that? And I think the responses when I've asked people that question before have been just all over the board.

Speaker D [00:42:11]:

Right.

Dane Deutsch [00:42:12]:

Everybody comes from a different kind of angle or background or experience to give a different answer. But it all comes back to the character skill wheel, and it really boils down to the fact that character is the foundation of leadership. We hear people tell us all the time, hey, leadership rises and falls. You know, everything rises and falls on leadership. But we don't often hear that leadership rises and falls on character, and it does. So I try to let people know that even if you're trying to work with character skills, you're trying to improve your character skills, and you've changed that mindset, and you go out and you try to be empathetic with someone or respectful or caring, you may get the door slapped, you know, shut in your face or the window shut, you know, or whatever, but you're still being yourself, and you're being genuine and authentic, and you're still caring so you can feel good about who you are and what you're doing, regardless of the number of failures that you've had. We talk about that a lot in our gym. Most Gymnastics training centers probably, or clubs are probably just training for the technical.

Dane Deutsch [00:43:16]:

Some of them might train for some of the people skills on those back two wheels. Right. So they're competent in gymnastics, leadership in the team and things like that, communication. But they're not very many of them that really put character education as the number one thing they're really trying to teach those kids. They're not going to do gymnastics all their life, but they are going to still be a human all the rest of their life. And so we've got to make sure we humanize even our interactions with each other. And so that's what, in some form or fashion, that's almost the answer I get all the time. It goes back and it's like people saying, well, if you're on your deathbed, you know, I've never heard anybody on their deathbed say, I needed to earn more money or I needed to make, you know, I needed to own another home or whatever.

Dane Deutsch [00:43:54]:

Right. What they're really saying is, I should have done more with my family, I should have done more with my friends. Those are the things that really count. And so I just encourage people, ask yourself that question, am I being true to myself? More importantly, am I being true to my own moral compass? There's a great book out there called moral intelligence 2.0. And I was certified by the. One of the guys that wrote that book by his company on character because they have shown and demonstrated through years of research now that companies that lead with character first have a greater return on investment and they have a much better engagement in their culture. Their culture is healthier and their people, people are happier, more content and joyful in their environment.

Speaker B [00:44:44]:

Yeah, that's great. Love it. All right, well, Dane, thanks so much for coming on the show. Before we get going, where else can people learn about you and your program?

Dane Deutsch [00:44:53]:

Yeah, so they can go to LMDC US like United States. So leadership and Management Development in Character US is what that stands for. LMDC us. And I've got a lot of different things they can take a look at there. A lot of resources. There's some free resources. Most importantly, I have a coachability book that I mentioned earlier that came out in November. So I'm giving a free forward and chapter one away.

Dane Deutsch [00:45:22]:

And the forward was written by Tom Ziglar. And of course, Zig Ziglar was first of all in sales, but as he got in his twilight years, he focused more on character. And so I was really privileged to have Tom write that forward in that light for our book so they can go to LMDC us and just look at the top of the menu. Go to books or courses. Our heights course is there too. So yeah, we're excited to share that with the world and hopefully we can make a difference and be more significant for people.

Speaker B [00:45:55]:

Thanks so much. Dean.

Dane Deutsch [00:45:56]:

Thank you very much. Brian Tricon.